Author Topic: FBA on gathered front knit top - what would you do?  (Read 3627 times)

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Offline ChristineB

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FBA on gathered front knit top - what would you do?
« on: April 29, 2008, 05:54:20 AM »
I'm planning to make  Simplicity 3790http://www.simplicity.com/assets/3790/3790.jpg (view D/E/F) and was wondering how to do the FBA.  I could add a horizontal dart, but I was thinking that there might be some way to incorporate the additional fullness in the existing gathers and/or yoke?  How would you approach it?
« Last Edit: May 01, 2008, 09:59:47 PM by ChristineB »

Offline LindaF

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #1 on: April 29, 2008, 11:27:58 AM »
Christine,
I have done a FBA for this type of top.  After you do the conventional FBA, you then rotate the resulting horizontal dart into the gathers at the neckline.

You can also do this the unconventional way, but I hesitate to mention it not knowing how much experience you have in doing this.  How much of an FBA do you need to do?
Linda
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Offline ChristineB

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #2 on: April 29, 2008, 01:25:22 PM »
Linda,

I have just enough experience to be dangerous.  ;D  And I love being unconventional.

Seriously, I'd like to hear your idea.   If it was just a small amount, I was thinking I'd ease a little fullness where a regular dart would go since I'm using a knit fabric.  But I need to FBA for a D/DD cup, so it's more than I think could be handled by ease (alone).

« Last Edit: April 29, 2008, 01:48:57 PM by ChristineB »

Offline DeniseM

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #3 on: April 29, 2008, 02:18:02 PM »
As someone who has to routinely do FBAs, I think Christine is right on target. Otherwise, I would put in a conventional dart, which I think looks really classy no matter what style you wear.

Check out Fit for Real People by Alto and Pletsch. It's the FBA technique I use and it never fails. You can probably find it in the library or used at amazon. Or, you look at Fitting Finesse by Nancy Zieman. She uses pivot and slide which I've also tried and it works very well.

Offline LindaF

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #4 on: April 29, 2008, 02:55:50 PM »
Linda,

I have just enough experience to be dangerous.  ;D  And I love being unconventional.

Seriously, I'd like to hear your idea.   If it was just a small amount, I was thinking I'd ease a little fullness where a regular dart would go since I'm using a knit fabric.  But I need to FBA for a D/DD cup, so it's more than I think could be handled by ease (alone).



Christine, I am a DD person too.  I do not always like the traditional FBA because at our size it curves that armhole just a little too much. ;)  Although in the latest issue of Sewing Today the Palmer/Pletsch ladies have changed the FBA for large chest woman.   It's worth looking at, although I saw something similar to this in another book.  I can't remember the name, but it was written a few years ago by a couple of womem who worked at G Street Fabrics.

Anyway, my unconventional way of doing this will work because there are gathers in the front.  It will be hit or miss because how much gathering in the front makes a difference in how this style looks in large chesties like us, IMO.  So experimenting is the key.  What is most important is get the proper length in the front.  If you get the correct length in the front you will get rid of those pesky drag lines in the front.  I know conventional wisdom says more width is needed to get rid of them, but I respectfully disagree.  I strongly feel that is horizontal balance issue going on and not width.

I know for me that my front length to my waist is 3.25" longer than my back length to my waist.  So I alter for that first,.  I slice horizontally all the way across at the bust point and spread the amount needed.

 BTW, this does mean that you have measured this on the pattern or at least found it printed somewhere.  You need to know what difference in length has been drafted in before you can add what is needed.   For example, I need 3.25" and 2" has been drafted in. (On my last top only 1/2" had been drafted in.  Who did that make that for???!!! :o)  I would then add 1.25" in length to get my difference.

On top of this - I told you it was unconventional - You need to make sure that your back length is drafted correctily for you also.  My full back length is 18".  So I usually have to add an inch to the back at the waist and an inch to the front at the waist before I can even tackle the bust line.

Now that you have added the length in the front you can do one of two things.  You can now draw in a horizontal dart pointing to the bust point, or you can take that extra length at the front side seam and move it to the neckline.  You do this by drawing dart with the outer legs touching the top and bottom of the space you inserted and drawing to touch your bust point. Cut that wedge out.  Then make one to two slashes at the neckline.  I like to space them evenly apart, so I measure where the gathers go, divide by three and make two slash lines.  Draw and slash these line to the bustpoint.  Try not to cut through the bustpoint, but leave a little paper hinge. Now close up the horizontal dart and let the two slash lines spread open.  The dart has now been transferred to the neckline.  and as an added bonus you now have all the length you need in the front and you do not have have a curved front, which is actually some of the bust dart moved to the bottom.  Study enough of those japanese sewing books and things start to click in the brain. ;D

At this point you may also need more width, depending on how you start with a pattern in the first place.  I start with a size 14 that has a 36 bust without ease and I am much larger than that number (I'll just say without saying the actual number).  So I might need more width at this point, DEPENDING on how much width I have gained from the unconventional FBA, the style of the top, the fabric used, the look I want.  In my personal experience, more width in this kinds of tops for a large chesty is not figure flattering.  You want to wear it a closer fitting that what the pattern may be drafted at. 

However, if you started with a pattern that was high bust measurement and only needed say 2-3" in extra width, that may already be built into whatever ease in drafted into the pattern. (I have no idea how much ease is built into this pattern as I don't own it. This is just my thought process as I approach a pattern)  On my last top that didn't make the cut, the pattern had 11" of ease. :o  I only needed probaby 3-5" and I stupidly settled on 8" ease.  I didn't need to do any FBA on that pattern at the 8" of ease using my HB.  I could have gone down another 2 sizes probably.

So each pattern is different and how much ease makes a big difference on look and fit.  There are alot of factors that go into each style.  That is why I have started doing some alterations that are mainstream differently.  Afterall it is what works for our body that is most important.

And like Denise says, you can leave the horizontal dart in if you want to.  But I wouldn't recommend that unless you plan on 3" of ease or less. Otherwise it will float away from the body too much and not look right.  And if you are making the sleeveless version, definitely do no more ease than 3" above your chest measurement.  After that you start to reveal too much under the arms.

HTH and sorry to be so long winded.
Linda
« Last Edit: April 29, 2008, 02:59:14 PM by LindaF »
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Offline DeniseM

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #5 on: April 29, 2008, 03:15:51 PM »
Linda, I'm not sure how you're doing your FBA. Making the FBA as shown in Fit for Real People should not do that, though it may require taking just a pinch in where the bust angles toward the armhole, but I've never had that problem. I am also a DD so I understand how difficult it can be to get clothes that actually fit. I haven't bought a shirt in years, only sweaters. But that's why I depend on muslins to fit myself properly.

I know the book you're talking about, the one written by the women at G Street. It's been out quite a while, I think at least since the 90s. I didn't understand the instructions as well as FFRP, and I don't own it, though it is very popular. I've started a thread on the best fitting solutions and I would be interested to see your take on this.
« Last Edit: April 29, 2008, 03:19:31 PM by DeniseM »

Offline LindaF

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #6 on: April 29, 2008, 03:17:38 PM »
Linda, I'm not sure how you're doing your FBA. Making the FBA as shown in Fit for Real People should not do that, though it may require taking just a pinch in where the bust angles toward the armhole, but I've never had that problem. I am also a DD so I understand how difficult it can be to get clothes that actually fit. I haven't bought a shirt in years, only sweaters.

Should not do what? 

Sorry, I am having a hard time figuring out what you mean?
Linda
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Offline DeniseM

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #7 on: April 29, 2008, 07:00:55 PM »
you say that doing a traditional FBA curves the armhole a little too much. I'm trying to understand what technique you're using to make your fba, what is "traditional" that it would do anything at all to the armhole.

Offline LindaF

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #8 on: April 29, 2008, 08:00:18 PM »
you say that doing a traditional FBA curves the armhole a little too much. I'm trying to understand what technique you're using to make your fba, what is "traditional" that it would do anything at all to the armhole.

Okay, got it.

The traditional FBA is the widely used one found in FFRP.  It does say in the book that it will not change the length of the armhole, but nothing about the shape of the armhole.  As a large chesty you do want the nice curve up you get.  But there is a point of too much curve.

So to properly answer your first comment.  I have done it properly and it does distort the curve of the armhole.   This was addressed in the book I mentioned earlier called Every Sewer's Guide to the Perfect Fit.  They state you should not make a FBA larger than 1" wide or otherwise it will overly alter the armhole shape.  In fact it says in their book that gong the FBA this way (which is the same method in FFRP) does distort the armhole.  But like I said, us large chesties need and like that slight distortion, not gross distortion.

And when you do a FBA as large as I need, it does distort the armhole.  ;D ;D

Linda
« Last Edit: April 29, 2008, 08:20:22 PM by LindaF »
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Offline DeniseM

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #9 on: April 29, 2008, 09:38:36 PM »
How do they address adding more to the bust in Every Sewer' Guide to the Perfect Fit? I usually add about 1" to my FBA depending on the size pattern I start with, which gives me a full 2" added to the bust. I find that works very well and if it's not enough I add to the adjustment by curving out over the bust up to 1/2" more but that only works with a princess seam.
« Last Edit: April 29, 2008, 09:41:35 PM by DeniseM »

Offline LindaF

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #10 on: April 29, 2008, 09:49:26 PM »
How do they address adding more to the bust in Every Sewer' Guide to the Perfect Fit? I usually add about 1" to my FBA depending on the size pattern I start with, which gives me a full 2" added to the bust. I find that works very well and if it's not enough I add to the adjustment by curving out over the bust up to 1/2" more but that only works with a princess seam.

Hi Denise,
The FBA alteration in the Sewer's Guide is the same as FFRP.  Only they advocate only doing a 1" wide FBA and then adding another 1" (x2) with a slash to the shoulder line.  This is similar to the new FFRP way found in Sewing Today.

So you are doing it exactly the way they say.  :D

Linda
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Offline Liana

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #11 on: April 29, 2008, 10:03:26 PM »
I've gotten some strangely curved armscyes when doing FBAs too.  (I'm also a DD.)  Once you wear it though, and the shaping all goes in the right place, the armscye fits just right.  I was interested to see that when I did my saran wrap bodice, the front armscye had the exact same type of curve that I was getting after doing an FBA.  I used Kathleen Fasanella's instructions for doing it, and she emphasized that you should not try to "correct" the pattern pieces to look "normal" since you were making a personalized pattern.

Offline DeniseM

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #12 on: April 29, 2008, 11:17:10 PM »
Aha. Thanks, Linda. That makes sense. So you're adding in two different places.  :cheers:

Liana, you are so right. When I was working with Shirley Cunningham's For the Fit of It, my patterns looked dreadful and the garment on hangers looked askew. But on me they fit just fine. That's where I learned to be brave about making adjustments.

Offline ChristineB

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Re: What would you do?
« Reply #13 on: April 30, 2008, 03:34:18 AM »
Thanks all for the feedback - I especially appreciate the comments re: considering the amount of ease when deciding whether or not to add a dart.  You've all given me a lot to think about before I start laying out my next project.

Christine

 

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